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Alain
JennYMusical Genius=Mentally Ill?
October 8th 2006 04:41
Can it be fairly stated that musical genius is derived of some form of mental or social-based disorder? We can all think of various artists who have lost their lives at the top of their career due to something self-destructive; drugs, suicide, etc. But is it fair to say that the genius of their talent contributed to their downfall or is the mental disorder-for the purposes of categorizing whatever it was that led to their deaths- separate from the talent?
Whose death do you feel had the greatest impact on music today or to you, personally and why?
Of the memories you have of that artist, what was the moment you considered them genius?
I do believe that true genius is borderline insanity. The pressure that comes from being truly talented and the fear of losing that talent leads to self-destructive habits, often drugs to ease the pressure or at times, to erase it altogether.
I wish I could be all philosophical about the loss of John Lennon and the impact that had on music but to tell the truth, I have never liked the Beatles. I have tried, believe me. I appreciate the impact their music had on America and the future of music, as a whole. But I also think they just happened to be the posterchildren for the inevitable change in music would have taken place eventually.
The biggest loss to music, in my opinion, was Layne Staley, of Alice in Chains. Consider the limited amount of music actually released by this band, how much of each 'new' release was actually re-released, how many absences there were from fans due to Staley's drug use, and to this day, how many groups continue to be influenced by AIC, like Creed, Godsmack, Hinder, etc. and consider the success these bands have had. Consider that the remaining members of AIC broke up after Staley's death and recently reunited for a reunion tour. Every show sold out within 15-30 minutes more than a decade since anyone last heard a peep from this group.
I think the moment I considered Staley(and AIC) to have genius talent was when watching the MTV release of AIC Unplugged on DVD. It was their first performance in more than three years and they came out one by one. Staley came out last and was so tremendously out of his head on heroin and whatever else that it was shocking. I wondered if he would even know where to go or what to sing. During 'Sludge Factory', Staley took off his sunglasses to show the world what he was going through. His eyes were so messed up that I just cried...and almost vomited. He never missed a beat and went on. His honesty was tremendous. He was telling the world that he would be gone soon in that simple action and with the appropriate background music playing. I just sat and watched him during that performance, his teeth eaten away by the heroin, his eyes completely glazed over, no practice in three years, and there he was, in the worst shape of his life, just as brilliant a performer as most would hope to be on a good day. I fell in love with Staley and his tortured soul and wondered as I did so, if that was a selfish thing to do, worshipping the thing that was going to kill him. The heroin just eased the burden of the talent he had. Not long after that, a couple of years in fact, Staley went into seclusion and was found dead in his apartment more than two weeks post mordem. Two weeks...no one missed him for two weeks...amazing.
Whose death do you feel had the greatest impact on music today or to you, personally and why?
Of the memories you have of that artist, what was the moment you considered them genius?
I do believe that true genius is borderline insanity. The pressure that comes from being truly talented and the fear of losing that talent leads to self-destructive habits, often drugs to ease the pressure or at times, to erase it altogether.
I wish I could be all philosophical about the loss of John Lennon and the impact that had on music but to tell the truth, I have never liked the Beatles. I have tried, believe me. I appreciate the impact their music had on America and the future of music, as a whole. But I also think they just happened to be the posterchildren for the inevitable change in music would have taken place eventually.
The biggest loss to music, in my opinion, was Layne Staley, of Alice in Chains. Consider the limited amount of music actually released by this band, how much of each 'new' release was actually re-released, how many absences there were from fans due to Staley's drug use, and to this day, how many groups continue to be influenced by AIC, like Creed, Godsmack, Hinder, etc. and consider the success these bands have had. Consider that the remaining members of AIC broke up after Staley's death and recently reunited for a reunion tour. Every show sold out within 15-30 minutes more than a decade since anyone last heard a peep from this group.
I think the moment I considered Staley(and AIC) to have genius talent was when watching the MTV release of AIC Unplugged on DVD. It was their first performance in more than three years and they came out one by one. Staley came out last and was so tremendously out of his head on heroin and whatever else that it was shocking. I wondered if he would even know where to go or what to sing. During 'Sludge Factory', Staley took off his sunglasses to show the world what he was going through. His eyes were so messed up that I just cried...and almost vomited. He never missed a beat and went on. His honesty was tremendous. He was telling the world that he would be gone soon in that simple action and with the appropriate background music playing. I just sat and watched him during that performance, his teeth eaten away by the heroin, his eyes completely glazed over, no practice in three years, and there he was, in the worst shape of his life, just as brilliant a performer as most would hope to be on a good day. I fell in love with Staley and his tortured soul and wondered as I did so, if that was a selfish thing to do, worshipping the thing that was going to kill him. The heroin just eased the burden of the talent he had. Not long after that, a couple of years in fact, Staley went into seclusion and was found dead in his apartment more than two weeks post mordem. Two weeks...no one missed him for two weeks...amazing.
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Comment by Hope
Gifted Parenting
Freelance For Life
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Comment by Dan
Okay, in al seriousness, I don't think there is a direct correlation between Musical Genius and insanity. I think it is the pressures of fame that cause so-called 'deviant' behaviours.
Yes, one must go through a diverse range of experiences in order to create great art (may that be music, film or visual art). Because art is about one's emotions and soul. In order for anyone to get to know their primal instincts, they must go through a degree of emotional trauma etc etc.
That being said, it doesn't make someone insane, but possibly brings someone closer. In my opinon, if someone is trully level headed enough, they can go through anything and stay sane.
So for people like Layne Staley, John Lennon, or Kurt Cobain, it's not purely their musical brilliance that brought them to their end. I think the pressures of fame and fortune can be the reason for all this.
Fame makes people paranoid. Who are your real friends? Who knows? They say it can be lonely at the top. I'd saythat this is the cause for celbrity insanity.
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Would you agree that Insanity and mental illness are two different things though? I am bipolar but I'm not insane. I just think that there might be a link between a chemical misfiring and one's perception on the events they go through which add a deeper level of consciousness to someone's art that may not be there without it.
I do see a lot of validity to your post though. Certainly, it can be proven that my theory is not always correct. There are many really successful people who were not 'tortured' as they did their thing.
Perhaps we are talking in too general of terms then. What about those whose art takes on a darker tone? Whose lyrics are powerfully emotional?
Evanescence new release, 'The Open Door', has a song entitled, 'Lithium'. Amy Lee's lyrics are always gut-wrenching, especially on their first release, 'Fallen'. On the second, they seem more light. The selfish part of me wants a return to the darkness that Lee credits in 'Lithium' to nontreatment of her disorder. Her talent may be effected by treatment, which if realized, will probably provoke Lee to discontinue it. If that happens, it will be a matter of time before she commits suicide or becomes unable to function, because of the progressive nature of her disorder.
Just one of many examples that has prompted this post.
Thank you for your thoughts on this...very thought provoking.
Comment by tinkster
was a tribute to the late Andrew Wood, also from Seattle, and also died of a heroin overdose. I decided
that Layne was a genius after the "unplugged". Nutshell is my favorite song by the Chains and the way
unplugged starts out with Jerry strumming on that guitar while each one walks out is great. Don't feel
bad because there are many people that feel the way you do. He was sometimes at his best, when
the drugs were at their worst. It is very sad, but true. He still was one of the best.
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Comment by tinkster
Comment by Anonymous
Pressure. Fame. Seclusion. Insanity. See, in this day and age, we have big words for what we think is the problem, and we take people and we pigeon-hole 'em under these words. So, what killed Janis, for example? Was it drugs, or was it loneliness? What killed Lennon, for example? Was it fame, or was it insanity? See, back then, the drug scene was a social thing. There wasn't a definate line between performer and fans, like there is today. The people that you played for came to the party afterwards. They were your fans, your roadies, your groupies, your life. There was no security, no measure of sorts in place to separate the minions from the idols. And, even the rockers were all friends. Oh, exept for the Isle of Wight Folk festival, where they had a corrougated iron fence surrounding the perimiter.
I guess the point I'm trying to make is, these days you have categories, back then, you didn't. You didn't know what depression was, you didn't know what alcoholism was, dependancy, in/sanity, abuse, all the rest of it. You didn't know you were gonna get sick from this, or have a problem because of that, whereas now, you do. It was a great time to be alive.
Parting thought: What about the people who never touched drugs? What about the people who should be dead ten times over? What would Janis be singing? What would Hendrix be playing? We all know Clapton (or Crapton, as I know him) can't and couldn't shine a candle to the likes of Hendrix, Santana, Vai, Van Halen, Vaughn, Townsend...Shall I go on? Everyone might have thier different takes on it, and that's OK, but you really have to ask someone who was there.
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Do come back and leave tons of comments! I loved yours. I love the question of what Janis would be doing today...etc. That is mind boggling, really. Would they even be a part of music as it stands today? What would Janis think of Britney Spears? Madonna? Christina Aguilera? Do give your take on this...
Come back,
Voices~
Comment by Anonymous